invocation of earth elemental

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invocation of earth elemental

Postby the atlas itch » Sun Nov 06, 2011 8:14 am

To invoke the King of Gnomes GHOB to visible manifestation (line 32 bis in 777):

http://www.lashtal.com/wiki/Path_32-bis

1. I would definitely end the operation with the LBRP, but the opening is unclear. Should I open with LBRP then do LRH with invoking earth element in all quarters with the following hierarchy – Thahaaothahe>Kerub>Phorlakh>Ghob? OR: Open with LBRP, then invoke earth in all 4 quarters in LRP (which seems counterintuitive since it reverses the LBRP) and then follow up with LRH and aforementioned hierarchy?
3. How are the names Thahaaothahe, Phorlakh and Ghob (some say KOB) pronounced?
3. Any tips to improve the success of this operation and/or warnings?

Thanks for feedback.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby Jim Eshelman » Sun Nov 06, 2011 1:36 pm

the atlas itch wrote:1. I would definitely end the operation with the LBRP, but the opening is unclear. Should I open with LBRP then do LRH with invoking earth element in all quarters

I would definitely begin with the Lesser Banishing Ritual of the Pentagram, yes.

For a purely elemental working, I wouldn't involve the Hexagram Ritual at all. I understand that there is an arguement that it could be used that way, but it seems to miss the point of a purely elemental working. The Lesser Invoking Pentagram Ritual of Earth is sufficient (or, if you choose, a higher frequency version of the invoking Pentagram Ritual).

with the following hierarchy – Thahaaothahe>Kerub>Phorlakh>Ghob?

I didn't read the ritual (i.e., didn't follow your link), so possibly that would have answered my questions, but...

Are you using the Enochian Tablet of Earth? If not, then why are you using the Enochian 'Supreme Elemental King' at all? (The best advice is usually to use these only in a distinctly Enochian working.) Also, that is a Yetziratic name - your hierarchy has no Atziluthic or Briatic names, which would be a serious mistake. (In a purely Enochian working, the Opening of the Tablet/Watchtower of Earth would have established the Atziluthic and Briatic powers.)

Normally, thogh, one would use this Enochian 'Supreme King' only to summon Enochian Yetziratic beings. I know that there are some Golden Dawn circles that try to use Enochian for anything at all, including classic Hebraic work. It has always seemed intuitively correct to me to use this only for distinctly Enochian workings, though. (Notice my word choice, speaking of personal impressions rather than giving any sort of hard answer.)

Were I doing this operation - first, I would never speak of invoking Ghob. He's Yetziratc. You evoke him. He's of a lower level than you are. Second, the hierachy I would use for Earth would be:
ATZILUTH: Adonai
BRIAH: Uriel
YETZIRAH:
-- Ruler: Kerub
-- Angel: Phorlakh
-- King: Ghob

OR: Open with LBRP, then invoke earth in all 4 quarters in LRP (which seems counterintuitive since it reverses the LBRP) and then follow up with LRH and aforementioned hierarchy?

Not counter-intuitive - it doesn't reverse at all. I wonder if the confusion is that you think of the LBRP as as an Earth ritual. It isn't. Even though the pentagrams you use for it are traced like the ones for Earth, they are generic pentagrams (different color, intent, etc.). - Even if they were Earth pentagrams properly (i.e., going with that theory), the thinking is that you are first clearing complex, impure forms of it, before putting simple, pure forms back.

So the LBRP first clears everything in general at the elemental/microcosmic level, and then the Invoking Pentagram Ritual of Earth attunes your consciousness and the space to Earth distinctly. Start with Nothing... then add Something.

Again, I see no reason for the Hexagram Ritual.

3. How are the names Thahaaothahe, Phorlakh and Ghob (some say KOB) pronounced?

Tha-ha-ah-oh-tha-hay (but see above: it seems out of place here)
For-lock (not that different from the English word for that thing draping over Harpocrates' forehead)
Gobe (rimes with lobe)

3. Any tips to improve the success of this operation and/or warnings?

Do you have 776 1/2? I wrote extensively on approach there.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby the atlas itch » Sun Nov 06, 2011 3:39 pm

Yes, I bought a copy of 776 ½ last year but my library is packed in boxes now.

So I will leave out the Hexagram Ritual and use only the Pentagram Ritual. I will also leave out the Enochian Supreme Elemental King as I don’t work with that system – I mentioned it only because the name was listed in the link from 777. I was especially looking for the correct hierarchy for this operation – so thanks providing it. Another source provided Adonai ha Aretz instead of Adonai but I presume the latter will work fine.

So I will open with the standard LBRP. Then do the Invoking Pentagram Ritual of Earth.

My question is how to perform the Invoking Pentagram Ritual of Earth.

After finishing with the LBRP, should I face NORTH, invoke the earth pentagram ONE TIME while vibrating the sequence of Adonai>Uriel>Kerub>Phorlakh>Ghob? If nothing manifests, then repeat the sequence again while only facing NORTH?

OR:

After finishing with the LBRP, should I invoke earth in EACH QUARTER while using the same sequence of divine and archangelic names as the LBRP (IHVH>ADNI>AHIH>AGLA and Raphael/east, Gabriel/west, Michael/south, Uriel/north) THEN face NORTH, and finish off by invoking earth once more and vibrate Adonai>Uriel>Kerub>Phorlakh>Ghob?

OR:

After finishing with the LBRP, should I invoke earth while using the divine name of ADNI and Uriel in EACH QUARTER and finish the same as with the LBRP (Qabbalistic Cross etc) and THEN face NORTH and finish off by invoking earth once more and vibrate Adonai>Uriel>Kerub>Phorlakh>Ghob?

Previous attempts to evoke Ghob to visible manifestation have not been successful so I’m looking for the variation that will be most effective.

Also I’m thinking of using Regardie to trace the sigil for Ghob (Gimel/3, Vau/6, Beth/2) while vibrating his name. Even though Ghob is an earth elemental, would it be correct to use the LUNAR kamea instead of the SATURN kamea to find his sigil since Ghob is linked to the path of Tau that connects Yesod to Malkuth?
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby the atlas itch » Sun Nov 06, 2011 4:02 pm

Jim Eshelman wrote:For a purely elemental working, I wouldn't involve the Hexagram Ritual at all. I understand that there is an arguement that it could be used that way, but it seems to miss the point of a purely elemental working. The Lesser Invoking Pentagram Ritual of Earth is sufficient (or, if you choose, a higher frequency version of the invoking Pentagram Ritual)

One last question:
I have performed the Greater Ritual of the Pentagram before but how would it be adapted to the evocation of Ghob?
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby Jim Eshelman » Sun Nov 06, 2011 4:10 pm

the atlas itch wrote:I was especially looking for the correct hierarchy for this operation – so thanks providing it. Another source provided Adonai ha Aretz instead of Adonai but I presume the latter will work fine.

Adonai ha-Aretz is one of the Divine Names of Malkuth, but not of the element Earth.

My question is how to perform the Invoking Pentagram Ritual of Earth.

After finishing with the LBRP, should I face NORTH, invoke the earth pentagram ONE TIME while vibrating the sequence of Adonai>Uriel>Kerub>Phorlakh>Ghob? If nothing manifests, then repeat the sequence again while only facing NORTH? [etc/]

If it is the Lesser Invoking Pentagram Ritual of Earth, then it outwardly (to physical eyes) looks exactly like the generic Lesser Invoking Pentagram Ritual. One difference is intention. Another difference can be the use of color - I recommend drawing the pentagrams in white light against a black background. Another technique often used is to draw the Taurus glyph in the center of the pentagram as the Kerub of Earth. (For when you get your books unpacked, see 776 1/2 p. 179 at the bottom for some of these points.)

After finishing with the LBRP, should I invoke earth in EACH QUARTER while using the same sequence of divine and archangelic names as the LBRP (IHVH>ADNI>AHIH>AGLA and Raphael/east, Gabriel/west, Michael/south, Uriel/north) THEN face NORTH, and finish off by invoking earth once more and vibrate Adonai>Uriel>Kerub>Phorlakh>Ghob?

In this, you are greating a customized variation of the Supreme Pentagram Ritual for Earth. You can use the Lesser, as mentioned above, if you wish - and work the hierarchy in wherever works for you.

After finishing with the LBRP, should I invoke earth while using the divine name of ADNI and Uriel in EACH QUARTER and finish the same as with the LBRP (Qabbalistic Cross etc) and THEN face NORTH and finish off by invoking earth once more and vibrate Adonai>Uriel>Kerub>Phorlakh>Ghob?

Again, a variation of the Supreme that kinda sorta resembles the way things are done in planetary workings with the Hexagram Ritual.

Previous attempts to evoke Ghob to visible manifestation have not been successful so I’m looking for the variation that will be most effective.

See my Sample Ritual #8 in 776 1/2 for remarks on evocation.

Also I’m thinking of using Regardie to trace the sigil for Ghob (Gimel/3, Vau/6, Beth/2) while vibrating his name.

Sure. For evocation that's an excellent idea.

Even though Ghob is an earth elemental, would it be correct to use the LUNAR kamea instead of the SATURN kamea to find his sigil since Ghob is linked to the path of Tau that connects Yesod to Malkuth?

I wouldn't use the lunar. I'd use something generic like the Rose, especially avoiding planetary kameas. (T.'.O.'.T.'. initiates of the Malkuth grade know of another kamea that is suitable - just mentioned in passing.) You could also consider creating a sigil from a composite of the letters of the name.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby Jim Eshelman » Sun Nov 06, 2011 4:13 pm

the atlas itch wrote:I have performed the Greater Ritual of the Pentagram before but how would it be adapted to the evocation of Ghob?

By "greater" I take this to mean "supreme." (AC called the "supreme" ritual the "greater" in Liber O, but the true Greater Ritual of Earth has never been published.)

This is partly stylistic. You seem to be wanting to combine your invocations for the evocation with the pentagram rituals themselves. You can do that - I like to keep them simple. That is, the purpose of the Invoking Earth Ritual is to attune your mind and the space to the principle of Earth (like tuning a radio). That being done, you can turn to the next separate task of establishing the full hierarchy and summoning Ghob.

Or, at least, that's how I'd do it. You may work your artistry differently. There is some flexibility.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby the atlas itch » Mon Nov 07, 2011 3:49 am

Thanks for that detailed explanation. I dug up 776 1/2 and took a look at all the notes you mentioned. Ritual No. 8 was a very useful guide. Also Eliphas Levi's Prayer of the Gnomes at the end was perfect for what I was looking for.

I think I now have everything I need - so thanks again.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby gmugmble » Mon Nov 07, 2011 7:37 am

the atlas itch wrote:Thanks for that detailed explanation. I dug up 776 1/2 and took a look at all the notes you mentioned. Ritual No. 8 was a very useful guide. Also Eliphas Levi's Prayer of the Gnomes at the end was perfect for what I was looking for.

I think I now have everything I need - so thanks again.

Let us know how it goes. :)
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby the atlas itch » Tue Nov 08, 2011 7:19 am

Hi gmumble, I'm working with several other people from varying traditions so it will take a while to prepare the groundwork. But I will keep you posted.

After studying Ritual No. 8, it seems the operator needs two main things for a successful evocation:

1. The ability to easily access the astral plane as well as the focus and visualization powers to manifest and materialize thought forms.
2. Having a clear telesmatic image of Ghob while performing the evocation.

The more I think about it, the core of the evocation is in the above formulation. The rest of the ritual apparatus - the right incense, colors, offerings, candles, sigil, etc - are simply external props to put the operator in the right mindset.

This leads to questions about the Triangle of Art wherein the evoked entity is supposed to manifest and the Magical Circle. After discussion with several people, I am seriously requestioning the traditional view that the Triangle and Circle protects against unwanted spiritual forces.

My questions are:

1. Does the Triangle truly "contain" the evoked entity or is the real function to "constrain" the operator's consciousness within the Triangle?

2. Does the Circle truly "protect" the magician from unwanted forces or is the real function to center and exalt his consciousness during the operation - where the actual "protection" lies in the raising of consciousness?

The traditional idea that a Triangle or Circle drawn on a floor can block out spiritual forces, which are ever-present and everywhere, seems like childish superstition. This leads to the third question:

3. Does the magician's mere utterance/vibration of divine names, without necessarily having the ability to rise on the inner planes to the appropriate level, exert power nonetheless over manifested spiritual entities during rituals? That is, for the attracted spirit - regardless of whether it is "out there" or manifestation of the magician's mind - does the sound or vibration of the divine name itself contain power and authority over it? Or should the magician's usage of various divine names in operations always be backed up by his ability to rise to the appropriate plane of the name - and, if not, he risks danger?

4. Last of all, has anyone heard of any practitioner who, by his or her own abilities to rise on the inner planes, discovered various divine names and mapped out hierarchies on their own, without consulting 777 or various other resources?

Thanks for feedback.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby Jim Eshelman » Tue Nov 08, 2011 7:45 am

the atlas itch wrote:My questions are:

1. Does the Triangle truly "contain" the evoked entity or is the real function to "constrain" the operator's consciousness within the Triangle?

Fair question... but, to return fair for fair, I need to ask you: What difference would it make in practice if it were one vs. the other?

An important part of the triangle's symbolism is that it is manifesting. It's a geometric form that tends to materialization. OTOH, it has been effectively used for centuries (longer?) as a containing field, and I hold that the magician, for safety reasons, needs the containing field. (Exceptions: Masters of the Temple who - to put it one of several possibnle ways - "bring the triangle with them.?)

2. Does the Circle truly "protect" the magician from unwanted forces or is the real function to center and exalt his consciousness during the operation - where the real "protection" lies in the raising of consciousness?

Raising and, even more importantly, controlling one's consciousness are sufficient, but few people can do it sufficiently. Involving other people makes this even more difficult - random thoughts can derail the entire process.

The circle serves another important role in the process. It accentuates duality. An almost paranoid sense of "what is in the circle" vs. "what can't get into the circle" is powerful magick. Besides stirring some of the lower-bandwidth emotional force on which evocation rides, it especially creates the dualism that is basic to the technique of the evocation. (Evocation is, per se, an enforced dualism.)

3. Does the magician's mere utterance/vibration of divine names, without necessarily having the ability to rise on the inner planes to the appropriate level, exert power nonetheless over manifested spiritual entities during rituals?

Experience proves decisively that magicians incapable of consciously awakening to Atziluth and Briah can effectively establish a well-anchored hierarchy by use of Atziluthic and Briatic names.

Were this not true, then there would have been almost no successful evocation in the history of the world, because there have been almost no people in the history of the world capable of consciously awakening to Atziluth; and those who have, generally haven't been interested in evocation.

One could suggest various theories about this, but I think the above empirical argument is the better answer.

That is, for the attracted spirit - regardless of whether it is "out there" or manifestation of the magician's mind - does the sound or vibration of the divine name itself contain power and authority over it?

The Hebrew "words of power" have always given me every indication of having intrinsic power over consciousness and its manifestations on various planes. (I think it is linked right into our DNA as a true root system of human consciousness - not at all "just another system.")

Or should the magician's usage of certain divine names - Assiah, Yetziratic, Briatic, Atziluthic - always be backed up by his ability to rise to these inner planes - and, if not, he risks danger?

The question implies the actual ability to do so. I submit (as above) that almost nobody can. Certainly one must reach as high (as deep) as one can - the struggle with this seems to have intrinsic value - but resting it on the ability to reach that goal is futile - especially since evocation has generally been the approach of the lowest, least developed of magicians throughout history.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby the atlas itch » Tue Nov 08, 2011 10:44 am

Jim Eshelman wrote:Fair question... but, to return fair for fair, I need to ask you: What difference would it make in practice if it were one vs. the other?

The difference between form vs essence and realizing to which aspect one needs to devote more time and energy to perform a successful operation.

One person might draw the Triangle correctly, sealing off the edges, and perform the evocation perfectly...but without any visible manifestation of Ghob. This would be a case of getting the form right, but not the essence of the evocation.

On the other hand another person who has strong powers of concentration and visualization and easy access of the astral plane might accidentally manifest Ghob in his room without performing a evocation ritual – simply by thinking about the entity. This would be a case of essence over form. In fact its a fairly common experience for ordinary people to unexpectedly “see” entities in their room.

I’m not advocating getting rid of the Circle and Triangle. Rather I am trying to understand their actual functions with regards to successful magick.
Jim Eshelman wrote:An important part of the triangle's symbolism is that it is manifesting. It's a geometric form that tends to materialization. OTOH, it has been effectively used for centuries (longer?) as a containing field, and I hold that the magician, for safety reasons, needs the containing field. (Exceptions: Masters of the Temple who - to put it in one of several ways - "bring the triangle with them.")

That’s interesting to hear about the geometric form.
Jim Eshelman wrote:The circle serves another important role in the process. It accentuates duality. An almost paranoid sense of "what is in the circle" vs. "what can't get into the circle" is powerful magick. Besides stirring some of the lower-bandwidth emotional force on which evocation rides, it especially creates the dualism that is basic to the technique of the evocation. (Evocation is, per se, an enforced dualism.)

I can understand using dualism as a technique but I'm having problems reconciling dualism itself with Crowley's assertion that spirits, demons, angels and gods are aspects of the Mind. Would it be fair to say that the magician, while knowing reality is all One, nonetheless uses the circle to create the fiction of duality in order to focus and sublimate energies toward a desired end and that the climax of the ritual is when the psychological barriers between self and Other is transgressed, generating the desired effect? Would that be an accurate summary?

My reading of the above is based on Ritual No. 8 where the operator himself appears to be the origin of the manifestation of Tiriel – hence the importance of using the ladders method and Colors Scale to raise consciousness and having a clear telesmatic image of Tiriel prior to the climax.

This would suggest to me that intense desire, fear and love are key catalysts for successful operations – opening the pathways to areas of consciousness normally not experienced. It recalls Crowley’s admonition to unite one’s consciousness passionately with the consciousness of others.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby Jim Eshelman » Tue Nov 08, 2011 11:10 am

the atlas itch wrote:I can understand using dualism as a technique but I'm having problems reconciling dualism itself with Crowley's assertion that spirits, demons, angels and gods are aspects of the Mind.

I have a couple of things to say about that. (Neither one takes a position on what the nature of the entities actually is.)

First, I place no authority on it. At that point in time, he wasn't even an adept (in the A.'.A.'. sense of things) - he was roughly what, today, we'd call a 3=8 and quite caught up in rationalism. This says nothing about whether his opinion was correct - it just puts that particular 1903 opinion in perspective.

Second, if that p.o.v. IS correct, then my original point is even more relevant. If the spirit is actually an aspect of one's mind, then it may take additional steps to force perception to the idea that it is an objective "other." (That's the whole point of evocation. If you just wanted to experience it AS part of your own psyche, there are other means. Evocation is "get it perceptible outside of me and objectified as OTHER.")

it be fair to say that the magician, while knowing reality is all One, nonetheless uses the circle to create the fiction of duality in order to focus and sublimate energies toward a desired end and that the climax of the ritual is when the psychological barriers between self and Other is transgressed, generating the desired effect? Would that be an accurate summary?

Broadly, yes.

Except... most magicians do not "know that reality is all One." They have an intellectual idea about it, or, at best, once upon a time they had an experience that (in the moment) convinced them of it - but, sitting down to do an evocation, most magicians do not know this (a matter of direct perception). - And, I would dare say, that those who actually know it from here-and-now perception will equally know that it's a matter of definition in the moment.

In any case, yes, the magician needs to be flexible enough to adopt the point of view that is useful to the operation at hand. Sometimes that means picking the carrots out of the chaos of the vegetable soup of the soul and setting them on a side plate. (Usually one shaped like a triangle. :twisted: )

My reading of the above is based on Ritual No. 8 where the operator himself appears to be the origin of the manifestation of Tiriel – hence the importance of using the ladders method and Colors Scale to raise consciousness and having a clear telesmatic image of Tiriel prior to the climax.

The operator certainly creates the conditkions of Tiriel's manifestation to the operator. One of these is the alignment with the hierarchy of Mercury, which gives the authority to compel the appearance. Another is preparing the suitable body for the immaterial Tiriel's incarnation.

This would suggest to me that intense desire, fear and love are key catalysts for successful operations – opening the pathways to areas of consciousness normally not experienced. It recalls Crowley’s admonition to unite one’s consciousness passionately with the consciousness of others.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby Shadow Self » Wed Nov 09, 2011 11:10 am

This would suggest to me that intense desire, fear and love are key catalysts for successful operations – opening the pathways to areas of consciousness normally not experienced. It recalls Crowley’s admonition to unite one’s consciousness passionately with the consciousness of others.


See, I always thought that is entirely incorrect. You must lose the lust for result, otherwise your magick won't have results.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby the atlas itch » Wed Nov 09, 2011 11:52 pm

Acting without lust for result does not mean acting without lust - or whatever strong emotion necessary. As Jim noted, if you are not moved, chances are, nothing else will be moved. In my experience strong emotional investment generates powerful results.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby the atlas itch » Thu Nov 10, 2011 12:04 am

Jim Eshelman wrote:Another is preparing the suitable body for the immaterial Tiriel's incarnation

Prior to the operation, was the vital fluid charged with the intent to have Tiriel visibly manifest or Tiriel's telesmatic image before pouring it on the charcoal?
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby Jim Eshelman » Thu Nov 10, 2011 12:13 am

the atlas itch wrote:
Jim Eshelman wrote:Another is preparing the suitable body for the immaterial Tiriel's incarnation

Prior to the operation, was the vital fluid charged with the intent to have Tiriel visibly manifest or Tiriel's telesmatic image before pouring it on the charcoal?

No. It was just raw life-fluid, dropped straight from the wound on a finger. (I kept a medical lancet on hand in those days - the sort of thing a diabetic uses (sterile) to draw blood.)
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby Lavir » Thu Nov 10, 2011 8:17 am

the atlas itch wrote:Acting without lust for result does not mean acting without lust - or whatever strong emotion necessary. As Jim noted, if you are not moved, chances are, nothing else will be moved. In my experience strong emotional investment generates powerful results.

There's a personal thing I've noticed concerning this. In my case the "enflame thyself" is not properly the agent evoking it is the mean to come to that point. It comes a point when emotion is - how I can explain it... maybe: "absorbed"? - and the result is a ruthless, cold state and *that's* the agent evoking, not the emotion(s) to come to that point.

Naturally this can change depending on the type of force you "connect" with; since I'm not much interested in evocation I've not tried different "channels".

The only evocation I performed was when I was very young using the Goetia and the link to the "power" was done via The Bornless One and the Goetia scripts. The first time I had no manifestation at all (while using a lot of emotion), in the second attempt, however, what I explained before happened (i.e. the emotion was "absorbed" in that cold, ruthless state) and then I had a very strong manifestation (in fact I almost {******} in my pants and I never tried it no more for the fear; now that fear has naturally passed but I am not interested in it no more - but I'm digressing :-))

I noticed this also when I perform art, in some cases. When I approach the canvas, in painting, the first "manifestation" is tied to emotion but then it comes a plateau that's beyond emotion and that's what creates art for me. If I cannot get to that plateau the result will be all another thing (and it's strictly linked to how strong that "link" is, also from a strictly technical aspect). At that point there's a flow, a sort of "communication", fuel is no more needed (and on the contrary it is counterproductive). At that point it's sort of like what Crowley describes in Samekh, e.g. your mental, astral and physical consciousness are somewhat absent so it's not more a state of emotion in the literal sense.

This is what I noticed in myself. I think that the key to do these things must be discovered and for anyone it can be different, I don't know. As I said, then, it can also depends on which type of force you connect to, to evoke.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby the atlas itch » Sun Nov 13, 2011 7:03 am

Lavir wrote:When I approach the canvas, in painting, the first "manifestation" is tied to emotion but then it comes a plateau that's beyond emotion and that's what creates art for me. If I cannot get to that plateau the result will be all another thing (and it's strictly linked to how strong that "link" is, also from a strictly technical aspect). At that point there's a flow, a sort of "communication", fuel is no more needed (and on the contrary it is counterproductive). At that point it's sort of like what Crowley describes in Samekh, e.g. your mental, astral and physical consciousness are somewhat absent so it's not more a state of emotion in the literal sense.

That's interesting. Thanks for sharing that.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby the atlas itch » Sun Nov 20, 2011 2:25 pm

From Levi's Dogma and Ritual ("The Triangle of Pentacles" and "Conjuration of the Four"):

On the Triangle:

Within the grand circle of evocations a triangle was usually traced, and the side
towards which the upper point should be directed was a matter for careful observation.
If the spirit were supposed to be from heaven, the operator placed himself
at the top, and set the altar of fumigations at the bottom; but if the spirit came
from the abyss this method was reversed.


QUESTION:
Given earth elementals come from the abyss, should the Triangle be drawn outside the Circle with the base of the Triangle closest to the Circle or should it be reversed with the point of the Triangle closest to the Circle?

On the Kerubic Signs of Elementals:

Bull = Gnomes who are commanded by the sword
Lion = Salamanders who are commanded by the bifurcated rod or magic trident
Eagle = Sylphs who are commanded by the holy pentacles
Water-Carrier = Undines who are commanded by the cup of libations

QUESTION:
Why is sword (air) used to command Earth while pentacles (earth) are used to command Slyphs?
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby Jim Eshelman » Sun Nov 20, 2011 2:32 pm

I think the main point to get from this is... don't necessarily trust Levi on technicalities.

He's fantastic for philosophy and right-seing, but sometimes a bit whacked on technique.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby the atlas itch » Sun Nov 20, 2011 2:44 pm

Ok, thanks for confirmation.

I’m currently transforming my entire library into pdf form – its incredibly efficient for research. If you could recommend any good titles for the evocation of elementals that would be appreciated (I already have 776 ½, Paracelsus’ treatise on Elementals and Bardon’s Practical Magical Evocation).
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby Jim Eshelman » Sun Nov 20, 2011 2:48 pm

For historic research and context, add The Greater Key of Solomon and The Magus.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby the atlas itch » Thu Dec 01, 2011 5:07 am

If the Elemental Sovereigns (Paralda, Niksa, Djinn and Ghob) are forces of Nature, is there a deity that corresponds to the concept of “Nature” and where would it be listed in 776 1/2? I am trying to find out who these Elemental Sovereigns answer to.

Elementals are said to exist inside their elemental world, but can they perceive outside of their respective world into the worlds of other elementals or our world?

Are the elementals similar to voudon loas?

Thanks for feedback.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby Jim Eshelman » Thu Dec 01, 2011 5:48 am

the atlas itch wrote:If the Elemental Sovereigns (Paralda, Niksa, Djinn and Ghob) are forces of Nature, is there a deity that corresponds to the concept of “Nature” and where would it be listed in 776 1/2? I am trying to find out who these Elemental Sovereigns answer to.

Qabalisically, they each answer to the Divine Name of their element.

In another sense, though, all distinctly elemental powers are forces of Malkuth, so they are manageable under its hierarchy as the field of the elements.

Are the elementals similar to voudon loas?

No, I think the level is all wrong (though the behavior is right!). The loas (like the Orishi) are much higher-rank entities than mere elementals. For example, they have distinctive character and characteristics. They serve much of the function of gods in other panetheons, but I've never had the feeling they are even Briatic. (However, they might well be Briatic - archangelic - beings in cheap clothing.) - Their primacy in those religions is too high to be merely elementals, but they could well be the very top of the elemental hierarchies, like the highest ranking (non-arch) angels, similar to the planetary angels; or, among the elemental hierarchies, the kerubim.
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Re: invocation of earth elemental

Postby the atlas itch » Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:30 am

Thanks for clarification on the loas. One of the interesting lines of thinking that has opened up with this earth working is the question of what makes us human.
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