Soror Mystica/Scarlet Woman

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Soror Mystica/Scarlet Woman

Postby Mercurius » Thu Jul 04, 2013 2:33 pm

Are these the same thing in function? From what I've been studying, I get that feeling.
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Re: Soror Mystica/Scarlet Woman

Postby Jim Eshelman » Thu Jul 04, 2013 4:52 pm

Mercurius wrote:Are these the same thing in function? From what I've been studying, I get that feeling.

I've never heard the term "Soror Mystica."

"Scarlet Woman" is a title of Babalon and, more generally, an archetypal expression of Binah.
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Re: Soror Mystica/Scarlet Woman

Postby Corvinae » Thu Jul 04, 2013 7:28 pm

http://www.iconoclastpress.com/sorormystica.html


It is an alchemical term. I think they are similar too.
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Re: Soror Mystica/Scarlet Woman

Postby Joshua » Wed Jul 17, 2013 12:22 am

Sounds like the author is expressing a personal experience. Babalon is not the scarlet woman. The scarlet woman is a vessel to channel Babalon even though her city spreads beyond. Doesn't matter if she's your mom or a whore by the same name.
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Re: Soror Mystica/Scarlet Woman

Postby Corvinae » Wed Jul 17, 2013 3:52 am

A Soror Mystica is a channel (vessel) as well, albeit of a different sort.
The terms Scarlett Woman and Babalon are pretty exclusively used ( Thelema) as is Soror Mystica (alchemy). Yet the function behind the idea is as ancient as humanity. They fulfill a need, eachin their own way. It would seem that the process of domesticating mankind gives rise to a psychological schism, thus creating a need for these interesting positions. But then again maybe that's just my personal experience. :D
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Re: Soror Mystica/Scarlet Woman

Postby Jim Eshelman » Wed Jul 17, 2013 3:52 am

Joshua wrote:Babalon is not the scarlet woman. The scarlet woman is a vessel to channel Babalon even though her city spreads beyond. Doesn't matter if she's your mom or a whore by the same name.

I totally disagree BTW (You're welcome to your opinion.) Equating "Scarlet Woman" with any human is an error (though Crowley - acting specifically in his office of avatar of The Beast - often identified certain women as avatars of S.W.). "Scarlet Woman" is the name of the office which Babalon occupies.
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Re: Soror Mystica/Scarlet Woman

Postby The_Hawkheaded_child » Wed Jul 17, 2013 5:01 am

Jim Eshelman wrote:
Joshua wrote:Babalon is not the scarlet woman. The scarlet woman is a vessel to channel Babalon even though her city spreads beyond. Doesn't matter if she's your mom or a whore by the same name.

I totally disagree BTW (You're welcome to your opinion.) Equating "Scarlet Woman" with any human is an error (though Crowley - acting specifically in his office of avatar of The Beast - often identified certain women as avatars of S.W.). "Scarlet Woman" is the name of the office which Babalon occupies.


Jim,

Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law.

If that is the case, what would then be the purpose of giving specific hints about the manners of Scarlet women; if not human; and if human; only related to women of Crowleys?

"43. Let the Scarlet Woman beware! If pity and compassion and tenderness visit her heart; if she leave my work to toy with old sweetnesses; then shall my vengeance be known. I will slay me her child: I will alienate her heart: I will cast her out from men: as a shrinking and despised harlot shall she crawl through dusk wet streets, and die cold and an-hungered.

44. But let her raise herself in pride! Let her follow me in my way! Let her work the work of wickedness! Let her kill her heart! Let her be loud and adulterous! Let her be covered with jewels, and rich garments, and let her be shameless before all men!

45. Then will I lift her to pinnacles of power: then will I breed from her a child mightier than all the kings of the earth. I will fill her with joy: with my force shall she see & strike at the worship of Nu: she shall achieve Hadit.


Of course it's all about interpretation, but I fail to see any reason to stain a book with verses - having no meaning - or only having a meaning to some specific avatar people. I can even identify and understand my "own" universe from reading verses aimed at Crowley himself (I also see a point in identifying with the prophet, the beast, in ones own life, expressing ones unique "beastly" nature. In the end I am he and he is in me. As a matter of fact, the book of the law is written to me, and this is mine universe you hear me!? Mine! ;)):

"O prophet! thou hast ill will to learn this writing.

11. I see thee hate the hand & the pen; but I am stronger.

12. Because of me in Thee which thou knewest not.

13. for why? Because thou wast the knower, and me."


This passage actually has a deep significant meaning for myself, in my own life. I sometimes feel like his slave... It is him that go, not me. To hell with "me" and long live that silent self calling the shots from behind the curtain.

Love is the law, love under will.

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Re: Soror Mystica/Scarlet Woman

Postby Jim Eshelman » Wed Jul 17, 2013 5:09 am

The_Hawkheaded_child wrote:If that is the case, what would then be the purpose of giving specific hints about the manners of Scarlet women; if not human; and if human; only related to women of Crowleys?

Those passages in particular IMHO apply exclusively to Neshamah, not to any human woman. (The similarity of some of the events - in AC's mind - to events in Rose's life doesn't change that.) I've written at some length on that in an article in Black Pearl (available as a free download), probably in No. 3.

These verses IMHO apply to the Binah within us - not some woman's life. I ride this point rather hard, because its misunderstanding has caused immense alienation of women from Thelema, and we need to set that aright.

FWIW this is how I see Liber CCXX overall: It is primarily (meaning, at its first and most important level) an instruction in consciousness, not in manifest events in particular people's lives. Such manifestations are particular expressions or even "leaks" - externalizations in Assiah as a consequence of not making the warranted changes in consciousness.
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Re: Soror Mystica/Scarlet Woman

Postby Alrah » Wed Jul 17, 2013 7:58 am

Interesting.

I see these verses specifically as instructions to women; encouraging a certain attitude to the work in specific regard to those who are fulfilling the role of the eagle in sex magick operations.

There is always a temptation for women in love to become only a passive receiver that is dominated by the partner without paying attention or regard to her active function in the work that is usually taken care of by her unconscious or subconscious mind. The heart is the balance but it must not dominate the work and make a woman into a stupid and servile creature that is dominated by the man through a dominant animus. So if the heart rules the head - kill it! (Just a little until it is in balance again). And 'be adulterous!" - is not an instruction to {****} around with any Tom, Dick or Harry, but an acknowledgement that women do not have one animus but several and they are all required to know just one partner in the work; in order for her to actively transmit and transmute her power, and that given to her, to the child.

I don't see this in terms of Binah... but I'm working different paradigms here.
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Re: Soror Mystica/Scarlet Woman

Postby nowhere-ma » Sat Jul 20, 2013 1:35 pm

43. Let the Scarlet Woman beware! If pity and compassion and tenderness visit her heart; if she leave my work to toy with old sweetnesses; then shall my vengeance be known. I will slay me her child: I will alienate her heart: I will cast her out from men: as a shrinking and despised harlot shall she crawl through dusk wet streets, and die cold and an-hungered.

The skeptic in me agree's that this isn't referring to a person per se but is more of a metaphor for nature itself?! That is to say if we see symmetry and balance in the natural world which is generally unconcerned with the individual but more concerned with life over all - then all life ceases if nature fails to remain objective or the symmetry balance of it is somehow disrupted.

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