No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

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No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby Frater Aurum » Fri Dec 23, 2011 12:45 am

93

A few months ago now I wrote a letter stating my desire to be initiated into the A∴A∴ and sent it to the address of the Canellarius in London along with numerous contact details. I am yet to hear a response. I'm the secretary for my OTO Lodge and I know we try and be very prompt with replies, so I'm puzzled. Is this address viable? Has anyone here received a reply from this address? Any help or friendly advice is very much appreciated.

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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby Archaeus » Fri Dec 23, 2011 1:21 am

93

Although I do know of Brethren from that lineage of the A.'.A.'. they do not often reply to letters, I believe the reason for this is quite simply that the Cancellarius is usually buried under a huge drift of letters requesting admittance.

I heard that he literally has hundreds of letters to get through, and very limited spaces for prospective students, so only a small percentage actually receive a reply.

Good luck

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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby Jim Eshelman » Fri Dec 23, 2011 10:18 am

Frater Aurum wrote:A few months ago now I wrote a letter stating my desire to be initiated into the A∴A∴ and sent it to the address of the Canellarius in London along with numerous contact details. I am yet to hear a response. I'm the secretary for my OTO Lodge and I know we try and be very prompt with replies, so I'm puzzled. Is this address viable? Has anyone here received a reply from this address? Any help or friendly advice is very much appreciated.

Since that's an O.T.O.-connected site, you probably would benefit from following up through O.T.O. channels. We have no munsdane relationship with that particular entity.
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby Frater Aurum » Sat Dec 24, 2011 5:43 pm

Thank you for your repies. It is sad that the great majority of honest people are continually disappointed when seeking out this Order.
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby Frater Aurum » Sun Dec 25, 2011 11:03 pm

Unfortunately that site refers me to an email address I've already tried, also I live in Australia so they wouldn't be able to help me anyway. Still stuck it seems, thank you though.
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby Frater Aurum » Mon Dec 26, 2011 12:04 am

I've been applying for A∴A∴ membership, I live in Australia and as C.O.T. as well as T.O.T. operate in North America they would not be able to help me, I will try emailing the A∴A∴ address from the site once more but I have never received a reply from this address in the past (nor any other for that matter), and I've made various attempts
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby Trevor » Mon Dec 26, 2011 3:41 pm

When all else fails: try, try again
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby Frater Aurum » Tue Dec 27, 2011 6:23 pm

Treor that's very good advice, it seems my prayers were answered, I've received two replies thus far, although I'm still unable to join the Order it is good to make contact
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby RaHoorKhuit93 » Mon Apr 09, 2012 6:24 pm

I have emailed the Cancellarius as well, but alas, with no results. The prerequisites for admittance into the CoT, which was my first route to go. Hey Jim, does a person with a high school diploma, a two year drafting certificate with college credits from a accredited vocational center, and NOCTI certification qualify for student education? Just wondering.
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby Frater Aurum » Tue Apr 10, 2012 8:03 am

Update:

I have been received by a Motta lineage. They're out there just try, try again.
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby zestymordant » Tue Apr 10, 2012 8:08 am

I applied through the outercol.org website and this is the story of what happened...

I tried to contact two other organisations via email at the time but they both came back with an automatically generated email failure notice.

I posted a copy of my "student task and oath" form on 12th June 2010 and received a confirmation email on the 6th August 2010.

Despite not having done all the studying I requested the exam via email on 8th September 2010 and received an email back with the exam on the 15th September 2010.

I finished the student reading probably towards the end of 2010 and took a look at the exam. It was very daunting looking and after drafting a few responses/ideas for a few questions I left it for a bit.

I attended an OTO meeting on the 3rd June 2011 and that inspired me to actually get my arse in gear and sort out the exam. After about a month working on it full time, I finally sent the completed exam back on 14th August 2011.

My Neophyte instructor got in touch via email on 21st November 2011, although I have not yet initiated as I currently cannot afford the journey from England to Norway.

Hope this helps anybody wondering/worrying about the timescale of things through this lineage.
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby Archaeus » Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:39 am

It can take time, years sometimes. I won't bore anyone to death with the old "When the student is ready" claptrap, although it does seem to be a common feature that the prospective student has to know how to ask.
Mainly though I think it is a case of logistics, Cancellaria are human and can only respond in their own time, and especially within larger lineages such as the two mentioned here which are well known routes of entry into the A.'.A.'. may simply be inundated with applicants.
Think of it as a job application where there are far more applicants than spaces, of those who apply only a handful will get interviews, and of those only one or two will actually get placements.

I'm also thinking that the attrition rate in the lower grades is quite high, last I heard was that about 1/7 Probationers get passed to Neophyte and only about 1/10 Neophytes make it to Zelator. (J Cornelius) Which means that there would actually only be very few "Neophytes" to go around.

As a general rule, persistence seems to help.
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby fraterlueh » Wed May 15, 2013 11:09 am

Do What Thou Wilt Shall Be The Whole Of The Law

It's weird, the whole "teacher appearing when the student is ready" thing.

After a few years of general "occult" study and practice, I stumbled upon a Thoth deck @ a bookstore that generally culls Crowleyana for their "upscale" web sales.

But, there it was, waiting for me, so i snagged it.

After working with the deck for a very short time, I became obsessed with looking more into the whole Crowley/A.'. A.'. segment. Over a couple of weeks, I similarly stumbled upon a few other books at that store that satisfy the curriculum, so much so that it only piqued my interest further.

I've quickly developed a desire to initiate. It can be described as a calling. That being said (typed...), I emailed the Cancellarius @ OneStarInSight.org, and got a reply the same day.

I took a few days to consider the prospectus, and replied that it was my will to be a student despite having most of the reading material accessible on Hermetic.org. Again, I received a same-day reply, and was accepted as student. Fkn' thrilled i am, and grateful too for this forum with all it's lovely insights into what i can expect when I pass my exam.

So, I dunno...proximity to one's potential master, availability of neophytes, timing, and but of course the "student getting the teacher when ready"

There are so many variables. I concur with the advice given in posts above: Don't Give Up.

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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby HA 86 » Wed Jan 01, 2014 3:21 pm

I have been trying to get a response from the Cancellarius at ordoaa.org for about 4 months now with no success. Has anyone else heard back from can@ordoaa.org? And if so, what sort of information did you include in the letter? I live in Yelm Washington so C.O.T. and T.O.T. are out of the question.
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby HA 86 » Fri Jan 03, 2014 3:59 pm

Should I take the lack of responses as meaning that no one here has ever heard back from this particular Cancellarius? I am trying again and again, but it is getting me nowhere. How often am I expected to send a letter before it borders on harassment? I don't want to add too much to the load of letters, but I am very serious about starting the student phase. This method of sending letters over and over again and hoping one of them gets you accepted seems to be crackpot. I have been longing for this for over two years, and now once my life is in a place where I can actually begin the wait is agony.
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby Takamba » Fri Jan 03, 2014 4:04 pm

I had to look it up. It took me 12 months before I got a reply.
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby HA 86 » Fri Jan 03, 2014 5:21 pm

How often did you send a letter?
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby Takamba » Fri Jan 03, 2014 6:06 pm

Seasick Crocodile wrote:How often did you send a letter?


I emailed that addy once and totally forgot about by the time I got my reply. The reply expressed what I already knew about the A.'.A.'., told me the rule about the of passing as a "Student of the Mysteries" and the justification for the changes behind it (published in Equinox I:7) and how even later it became more flexible (too bad I'd already followed I:7). The "letter" (email) then explained how there were four different ways to be recognized as having finished the above alluded to "program" (of which you probably already have done one or two by now). It discussed the College of Thelema (of which this site is the public window to) and it being one of the four methods. And then it went into great length about the need for person to person contact with the "neophyte" you'd be training with. This will be your most crucial point, if you think about it. You must be free enough in your life to make a least an annual journey and for various reasons. And for other reasons, you might want to make this journey more than annually.

Then from there it is up to you what to do next.
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby HA 86 » Fri Jan 03, 2014 6:17 pm

You only sent one email? Well I feel like an ass. Thank you for your response. I am still amazed that a cat can type.
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby Gnosomai Emauton » Sat Jan 04, 2014 7:25 pm

My first time out, I didn't receive a reply either. At the time (this was quite a few years ago) I didn't have a solid sense of what the different lineages were or how they differentiated themselves online so my followup ("Hey, why haven't I heard anything back from you?") email went to outercol.org from whom I did eventually receive a reply which included a Student Exam. The exam took longer than expected to complete (life situation changed pretty dramatically right around that time) but I did eventually submit it, to which I got the standard, "We've received your exam, we're totally overwhelmed in life but we'll be in touch once we've had a chance to review it," and then nothing. I suppose I could take this as them passing unfavorably but, without any response whatsoever, who knows?

My next step was to knock again at the door of ordoaa.org by sending them the completed Student Exam with the understanding that it wasn't issued by their particular lineage but that it should, at the very least, demonstrate my readiness to submit myself to whatever their Student Exam may be. Still no response. I recalled at this point the meme of needing to knock thrice before the door would be opened so I submitted one more application, this time by mail. Again, no response.

However... in the process of making sure that all my t's were crossed and i's dotted for that third and final knock, I happened upon another door that opened almost immediately. It is not a direct entry to A.'.A.'. but it will get me there eventually and, in truth, is allowing me to work on some things that I likely never would have had I gone straight into the A.'.A.'. path.

So, I'm not going to repeat the old "teacher will arrive when the student is ready" post hoc ergo propter hoc chestnut because, honestly, I look back on where I was and I think I would have been ready at any point in that limbo period to engage in the work that ultimately opened itself up to me. My best evaluation at this point is that there just aren't enough Neophytes out there to take on everyone that wants to be a student so, justified or not, the door isn't answered as often as one would like. But, I will say that there are doors and they can be opened. It might just need a bit more of a creative approach to get the doorman to wake to your knocking.

Keep trying, though. It's worth it.
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby HA 86 » Sun Jan 05, 2014 1:13 pm

This lineage particularly appeals to me, possibly because I first came across the A.'.A.'. through the ordoaa site. I just don't want to waste my time waiting on a response that may never come. Nor do I want to settle for the outercol.org path, but they do seem to be more likely to respond so I am considering it. Call me old fashioned but I think a letter should be responded to more promptly than a year's time.
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby Mephisto » Tue Jan 14, 2014 1:53 pm

Go watch "Fight Club," where the "Aspirant" is made to stand on the doorstep for three day's time and berated with all manner of physical, emotional, and psychological abuse. The Aspirant is not told that such abuse is "per norm;" it is the Aspirant's decision to stay on the doorstep until admitted.

This just to say, "perseverance brings sublime success."
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby HA 86 » Thu Jan 16, 2014 6:33 pm

I prefer the book, as is usually the case, it is better. If there were a physical location for me to stand at and get rejected and tried that would be different, I could handle that eventuality. However, in this case, I may never get a response; but I will wait a year since that is the only response I got. Also, I have an alternative I can resort to that offers the same thing, where as there was no such thing in Fight Club.
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Re: No reply from A∴A∴ Cancellarius?

Postby HA 86 » Sun Jan 11, 2015 1:27 am

As an update: I was able to get a response from onestarinsight.org, I passed my examination, and will be scheduling my Probationer reception soon. :D They weren't my first choice, but at the time I did not know that they also came from Jane Wolfe's lineage; once I e-mailed them I heard back within the week.

(edited for clarity)
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