AEthyr 16 - Sign of the Master of the Temple

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AEthyr 16 - Sign of the Master of the Temple

Postby mojorisin44 » Thu Mar 24, 2011 3:49 pm

In Aether 16 and verse 20 the "virgin that rode upon the bull" describes the Sign of the Master of the Temple to Crowley. Was this Sign established before his vision or afterwards?

Also, in verse 22 Crowley gives the "sign that only I may know" . In the commentary it is suggested that it is the sign given in verse 5, which seems to be a sign of humility. It seems to be linked to possibly his humility sexually.
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Re: AEthyr 16 - Sign of the Master of the Temple

Postby Jim Eshelman » Thu Mar 24, 2011 4:45 pm

mojorisin44 wrote:In Aether 16 and verse 20 the "virgin that rode upon the bull" describes the Sign of the Master of the Temple to Crowley. Was this Sign established before his vision or afterwards?

I'd have to look through his notebook. I'm pretty sure it was before. (Somewhere in the visions, doesn't it say he already knew this sign?) I'll try to remember to look that up for you tonight.

Also, in verse 22 Crowley gives the "sign that only I may know" . In the commentary it is suggested that it is the sign given in verse 5, which seems to be a sign of humility. It seems to be linked to possibly his humility sexually.

That was my impression.
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Re: AEthyr 16 - Sign of the Master of the Temple

Postby Jim Eshelman » Thu Mar 24, 2011 5:02 pm

Here's the earliest reference to the 8=3 sign I can find.

In Crowley's personal grimoire, we find the handwritten copy of Liber Pyramidos that he wrote out on his John St. John retirement in October 1908. On the very next page (or, actually, filling out the remainder of the last page, right under the line "Khabs Am Pekht"), he listed "The Signs of the Grades of the A.'.A.'.." For Binah, he listed, "As Asi with Babe."

Although this could have been written later, the section heading and some of the content (including some content referring to N.O.X. signs) appears to be in the same pen. The 8=3 sign and some other content does appear to be in a different pen, so may have been filled in later, but the section overall was probably written soon after October 1908.

This was during the time that the A.'.A.'. system was in development, and several things in the notebook at this section are obvious development notes, including the earliest summary of the tasks of each of the grades.
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Re: AEthyr 16 - Sign of the Master of the Temple

Postby mojorisin44 » Fri Mar 25, 2011 11:21 am

Thanks for taking the time!

One question that keeps popping up for me is the age old dilemma of "what came first"?

In this case I was thinking - "Did he discover the sign in his vision and then incorporate it into the A.'. A.'. system or was the sign imbeded in him beforehand via the Golden Dawn or collaboration with Cecil Jones?"

I imagine that he didn't consciously know anyone in the Third Order beforehand (unless Aiwass communicated it) and so then I ask how did they formulate the sign and oaths of those degrees? I imagine that these were developed via correspondences that they attributed to those Sephiroth and then later the actual attainment filled in the gaps.
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Re: AEthyr 16 - Sign of the Master of the Temple

Postby Jim Eshelman » Fri Mar 25, 2011 11:28 am

mojorisin44 wrote:In this case I was thinking - "Did he discover the sign in his vision and then incorporate it into the A.'. A.'. system or was the sign imbeded in him beforehand via the Golden Dawn or collaboration with Cecil Jones?

Not before, I'm sure. And not in G.D. So he developed it alone, or in conjunction with Jones, in the formation period.

I imagine that he didn't consciously know anyone in the Third Order beforehand (unless Aiwass communicated it) and so then I ask how did they formulate the sign and oaths of those degrees?

In December 1906, Jones advised AC that AC had been admitted to 8=3. - I'm sure the sign was manufactured. (The A.'.A.'. signs for 6=5 and 7=4 are not those used in the G.D./A.O. either.)
Love is the law, love under will.
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Jim Eshelman
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"Success is thy proof: argue not; convert not; talk not overmuch!" - CCXX 3:42
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Re: AEthyr 16 - Sign of the Master of the Temple

Postby mojorisin44 » Fri Mar 25, 2011 12:57 pm

I mistook his feeling "unworthy" for having not been accepted into the Third Order. Also, having not passed through the Abyss "in the fullest possible measure". However, as I understand this doesn't mean that the path wasn't open to him. The last part of Chapter 59 of Confessions and specifically the last paragraph describes what I was misunderstanding.

Thanks.
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